Opinions on Mackie Onyx mixers ?

I wonder if the model 12 uses your standard budget mixer ICs orsome new surface mount versions. Almost every mixer/console under 50k since trident released the ever popular 80 series has been loaded with tl072s for eq and tl072s and/or tl074s for fabder emps etc and then ne5532 chips for the summing amps. Nothing really wrong with those OP amps despite their mediocre slew rate on paper and using newer, 'better' chips can cause oscillation in some circuits like thus and will definitely need more DC blocking from c ou pulling caps which can negate some of the benefits... however there are options that are perfectly suited too... it would be great if tascam took a hint from the modding community and went with thru hole ICs and sockets on the PCB for easy swapping. If my desk were socketed I would take it apart and try some swaps... as it stands it's a lot of trouble just to unsolder the old fader amps and resolder in a burr brown alternative 32 times letslone try to hit up 32 4 band EQs which may not provide much of an improvement. Even 10 summing Amos is pretty intimidating and I'm pretty darn handy.

I really wish companies would take a cue from the boutique guitar pedal market and socket this stuff so the end user can tinker with their sound. Creation Audio, formerly Soundcraft USA's service department, has some really cool opamp for this style of console that might help even a Mackie out but getting them in there is a bear without really pro level desoldering gear. A lot of mixer modders just go ahead and add sockets to make the whole process easier as they experiment. Why not go that route as a manufacturer? Probably some nonsense safety laws!

I wish there was at least something on the market like SSL BiG SiX, but with modular/serviceable/mod-able channel strips. Something with the per-channel accessibility of like a Soundcraft 200B. Am I overlooking anything out there under $10k new?

I wish there was at least something on the market like SSL BiG SiX, but with modular/serviceable/mod-able channel strips. Something with the per-channel accessibility of like a Soundcraft 200B. Am I overlooking anything out there under $10k new?

If it doesn't need to be fully modular there's a 16 channel audient or maybe a 16 channel trident 68. Not fully modular designs but fully modular is expensive new....

I wish there was at least something on the market like SSL BiG SiX, but with modular/serviceable/mod-able channel strips. Something with the per-channel accessibility of like a Soundcraft 200B. Am I overlooking anything out there under $10k new?

If it doesn't need to be fully modular there's a 16 channel audient or maybe a 16 channel trident 68. Not fully modular designs but fully modular is expensive new....

Yikes, just looked at the prices. I'll keep dreaming of the BiG SiX for now... and just hope it's more serviceable than it looks. Nothing good could come from me having access to 500 series modules... that leads down a path I'll never recover from.

Theres nothing under 5 figs anymore that's meant for studio use.... people want a mixer, you can tell by how many mixer/interfaces they sell. Theres a big gap in the market these days between like a model 16 and an Audient 8016 (I think its called)... the days of even the mackie sr24 8bus are over. I'm surprised behringer hasn't used midas to tap thus market but maybe they really wouldn't sell any.

Theres a big gap in the market these days

I think that's true of almost everything these days... shrinking the middle class means shrinking mid-range products too.

Either its the cheapest crap or its priced out of range...

I'm surprised behringer hasn't used midas to tap thus market but maybe they really wouldn't sell any.

The profit margins on a $40k console are pretty great, I imagine. Putting out products that sounded like $40k, but only cost $6k might cannibalize the bottom half of their customer base... could be too tempting for small venues and small studios on the cusp to resist... but that's just a wild guess off top of my head. I have no idea, really.

What's your opinion on the BiG SiX?

What's your opinion on the BiG SiX?

My first impression when atlas, vintage king and sweetwater spammed me to gush about it wsd that its not enough mixer to mix most projects on, it would just be an elaborate summer if you believe in summing.... nor does it offer enough preamps to be a project studio front end. 4 mics and some line ins even if you add outboard preamps to get some more microphones up will just not be sufficient for even that level of paying work unless you're exclusively hip hop and modern pop and you dont ever do rock bands or let the roots come by. Its dead aimed at the amateur singer songwriter and dj who dabbles in hardware market... I think they learned from that little notepad they released previoudly.... I'm sure big6 sounds good but SSL is about large channel count,every processor you need o every channel, big power supplies that deliver punch but need to be left on virtually all the time.... it just seems like for what they charge you're paying mainly for the few pres and the name. Without all that analog dynamics processing and eq, routing and the massive power reserve for bass transients I just don't know what's so special about an SSL. It's got a 1 knob compressor and what they call e series eq but we ith only 3 bands and it doesn't look sweepable let alone parametric. Wtf? How much better is it than stuff costing less than 1/10th? I'll have to look at it again later but I'm dubious. I'm even dubious of the new origin console. But this thing has the feature set of a $600 mixer from what I can tell and you're just relying on their word you're getting the sound quality... personally I don't think the SSL spund is that spectacular. The desks are super functional to the point where Andy Wallace can use a G series or bigger with almost no outboard to mix all those hits.... every channel has basically what you need to mix and the routing i7 s monstrously flexible to exploit all those tools to the full. You subtract anything and you gotta start asking why its $3I? No gates? Really? And the EQ is severely limited. SSL E series EQ is workmanlike but it's by no means some magical engancer... 4 fully parametric bands per channel and splittable filters are what they built their rep on.

Edit: I think they're trading on their name to people who have never been behind an E or G. There are much better sounding desks but very few bring all those features to the party and the few that have were and still are in unobtainium price ranges... only very famous 1st call music studios and movie studios can finance a neve 88rs for example. And AMS/neve were late to the party with that desk. I think it's a 21st century design. Everyone was chasing SSL's feature set to the point where the matketwas a lot smaller due to Napster and CPU technology by the time Amek and AMS caught up.

No sweepable mids on the BiG SiX? What?!?

If you can't sweep your mids, how do you expect to sweep me off my feet?

In a lot of ways, I feel about these 20th century big-time big-studio brands the way Chuck D. feels about Elvis.

Most of the stuff that got me excited about creating music myself were 90s electronic jams made in people's bedrooms. The fact that you could do 90% of the work at home, without having to shell out big $$$ for studio time, was the whole draw... if the results don't sound like the 19th remastering of Abbey Road, it's not the end of the world. So if these big-time big-$$$$ studio brands can make me something that truly sounds more musical than what else is out there, to the point that it saves me time and makes work easier and more enjoyable, I'm interested... but I'm with you that it needs to be measurably, demonstratively superior to the stuff costing 1/3 the price.

I 9only see 3 knobs on the big6 and they don't look like dual concentric pots. SSL eq should be 4 bands with dual filters, fully parametric.

I 9only see 3 knobs on the big6 and they don't look like dual concentric pots. SSL eq should be 4 bands with dual filters, fully parametric.

That was a rhetorical question mark. I fact-checked before I made that post. You were correct, it's definitely not sweepable.

That was a rhetorical question mark. I fact-checked before I made that post. You were correct, it's definitely not sweepable.

Ah yes. I just used my eyes there. That may contain the same topology as the E series but it's not even close. The E series is not the sweetest eq. It's less screamin' shrill than G and J series fitted with those stock designs instead of bring customed with E series eq but it's about being parametric on a desk. To even get close I would need a switch to go between widesnd narrow Q and even then 3 bands? I'm really underwhelmed with SSLthese days.

I have no clue what one would use the big6 for. It's not enough preamps to track drums doing anything but beatles techniques... the super analogue pre is not anyone's first choice for vocals and if I have to buy outboard pres for drums etc to do an ensemble I'll be using those for the lead vocal... I guess it's cool for guitar overdubs or like live tracking an nin record?

I don't feel like I could mix on this. It lacks routing, channel count and even the eq features of my lowly soundtracs desk eq.... I could sum with it in hybrid but then the compressors are worthless since 1 knob and no stereo link (I dont always link a stereo bus but sometimes you have to) is not usually going to cut it in that role. Maybe you can use them printed for nice hot overdubs? I don't get what the thing is for. It's not enough to do any job effective at a professional level and its price tag and supposedly sound quality are geared towards professional work... or at least semi pro like myself. The power supply better pack some serious punch because that's most of the SSL sound, that and the bus comp.

For what it costs I bought a 32 into 8, 6aux, inline semi pro desk thats been babied for 20 years that sounds damn good with money left for a whole sabre loaded interface network with more io than I often need not to mention gobs of cable, some of it custom... if I were soundcraft I would work up a competitive product based on the old saphyre or the even ghost including some of the common mods and offer 16 or 24 into 8, inline routing, 4+ auxes and dedicated echo returns and the interface and controller features for the same price. I think it could be done thanks to modern manufacturing. Would the big6 sound better? Somewhat.... would a useable studio centerpiece negate those sonic benefits? Hell yeah it would.

End rant.

Although I had this 1 thought now that I'm pretty sure my soundtracs desk was pricey for a non modular when new... about 5k without the optional meterbridge... still, when we compare the SSL offering with less than 60% the functionality? It better sound drastically better.

Isn't thatjust Yamaha's modular control surface for cubase/nuendo?

You're asking me ? 😂

Isn't thatjust Yamaha's modular control surface for cubase/nuendo?

You're asking me ? 😂

I was being 50% rhetorical?

Hey PKen my man. In a fit of masochism I've been sitting with the schematics in my console's hard copy service manual as well as PDFs of it's great grand daddy the trident 80b and the 1982 service manual for the SSL4000E including both the 02 and 242 eq revisions upon which the big6 is supposedly based. I have lit if insights from input to power supply, none of them complimentary to SSL's current marketing department if you wanna start a new thread. I'm doubling down on my negative impressions of big6 and my longstanding opinion that SSLs repytarion was built on features, routing flexibility and automation but not superior design or components unless you are talking strictly about ground scheme and switch quality... it's a lot if switches on even a 4k.

I love it. We're a few boxcutters away from being full-on hijackers of this thread, my friend. If you're feeling full of momentum, start that new thread and I will join with my usual inquiries and interest. And if we really get it cooking I'll see if we can pull in a few of the 4 & 8 bus folks in the community who have so far been quiet. This is one of those cases where I'm down for whatever subject the professor wants to teach. ;)

And if we really get it cooking I'll see if we can pull in a few of the 4 & 8 bus folks in the community who have so far been quiet.

4 and 8 bus? You mean like the in line Mackie sr24 models? Oooor?

And if we really get it cooking I'll see if we can pull in a few of the 4 & 8 bus folks in the community who have so far been quiet.

4 and 8 bus? You mean like the in line Mackie sr24 models? Oooor?

I meant anyone here using a mixer of decent size in their project studio that might want to educate themselves along with me.

I meant anyone here using a mixer of decent size in their project studio that might want to educate themselves along with me.

Oh yeah. Derp. Now I get it. My kid is turning my brain to mush!

I'm by no means an expert on all things mixer but I can definitely talk shop on IC based desks on and the SSLs are even more IC based than I had realized, just a different riff on the trident 80b recipe with extra seasoning and lots of garnishes.

Edit:

Any thoughts on what to name the thread?